Line level impedance

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electra225
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Line level impedance

Post: # 15256Post electra225 »

This may be one of those questions that everybody knows the answer to but me. Please bear with me... :oops: ;)

Is there such a thing as a standard for output line level impedance? What would be considered as "normal" line level output impedance? Does anybody know the line level input impedance on Magnavox bi-amps? On the regular Magnavox amps such as the 88 series or on the 93 series? I have been lamenting since time immemorial of the strangled bass response on the bi-amps I own. I have had some tinkering time in the shop the last couple of days and have perhaps discovered that I may be slandering devices that are not totally at fault. It seems like every device I connect to the tape input on the Concert Grand gives a different bass response. The reel-to-reel deck somewhat the best bass response, the RCA CD changer, somewhat the most pitiful bass response. I don't have a working record changer in either of my big Magnavoxes, but FM doesn't sound all that bad. FM around here is mostly commercials and Spanish music, mixed in with some rock. I realize most FM stations mix their audio so it will "boom" when people drive around town with their trunk full of subwoofers. But it at least lets me get the hint that the CG is capable of reproducing decent bass. This got me to thinking that maybe part of the problem is what I have been feeding it, what I have been using to reproduce music. Since a Concert Grand was built as a big record player with the radio tuner and inputs as an afterthought, I decided maybe a little experimentation was appropriate. Would a graphic equalizer between the input device and the amp provide a better impedance match? Or would it overdrive the amp? I don't have one of those devices everybody uses, whose name has escaped me. Bluehound or Blueberry, something like that. Bluetooth, that's it. Bluetooth. Would a Bluetooth sound better/different than the old fashioned devices I'm using? There has got to be a design change between the bi-amps and the regular amps that cause strangled bass in the tape input. I have looked at and studied schematics, but I don't see a difference. The tuners used with bi-amps have a cathode follower circuit, but I don't know how that would change the input impedance. Any thoughts or ideas?

Another thing I'll mention in passing. Years ago, there was a discussion on ARF about this very topic. A member there whose is a retired electronics engineer and who gives considered and accurate opinions, suggested inserting a 3300 ohm resistor in the input of bi-amps to change the crossover frequency between the treble amp and the bass amp. I haven't done that, but that does suggest that perhaps output/input impedance is a factor.
I haven't failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work.....Thomas Alva Edison
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electra225
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Re: Line level impedance

Post: # 15266Post electra225 »

I found something else I hadn't considered. At watching reel to reel tapes run and listening to them on the Concert Grand, I have found some of these tapes aren't as good as I thought. With the horns and a decent top end, I can hear lots of dropouts. Watching the VU meters on the tape deck, they barely move. Some of the tapes were recorded with insufficient signal for good bass to be reproduced. There are some Eddy Arnold "Nashville Sound" selections on that tape that should sound good. The tape may be deteriorating after time. It's also possible that whoever recorded the tape wasn't paying enough attention to the input level. There is also a lot of noise and hiss I hadn't heard before.
I haven't failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work.....Thomas Alva Edison
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TC Chris
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Re: Line level impedance

Post: # 15268Post TC Chris »

The usual idea is to have a low output impedance on the supplying device, and a high input impedance on the amp that's being driven, to avoid response anomalies, right? Maybe you could locate specs for a component amp (they were more likely to have published specs) with a similar input circuit, and estimate from that.

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Re: Line level impedance

Post: # 15498Post Hydrolastic »

Hello, I may be the least qualified guy to answer this since I have blown up two amps so far and I think a speaker as I have been learning about the biamped (amp182BA) and the non biamped amplifiers (Amp 175) but this is about inputs and not outputs.
On both units when I hooked up the bluetooth adapters (two different brands adapters) to the tape inputs I noticed the volume was quite low compared to the radio or phono when you switched over the selector switch also the bass was quite subdued. Then tried a input line amp (two different ones ) and what I found with that is mixed results. The one brand doesn't sound as good and is much more sensitive to how its set. The other one sounds better (mostly in bass)(photo). I think it has to do with input line voltage and I found that for the Amp 182 that the input is sensitive to this. There is a sweet spot where the stereo has bass and treble and the timbre is very noticeable in range. I also like the fact that the line amp L and R channels can be adjusted independently so in effect is a balance adjustment. The good line amp is meant for car radio so it needs a 12V wall transformer to make it work but also I found it has to be the right one as some don't rectify the ac correctly and it won't work ( ask me how I know ) so it has more setup and wiring. I was very pleased with it as far as the sound though. I also have found this in the SAMS for the amp 182 which may help but I am not sure if input voltage effects output voltage. But I would think the the line voltage would be similar for the separate 82 series amps. I have not had a way to test any of the consoles as all the turntables I have run slow. but I did get a test record for the day I am able to test it. I may be way off base here let me know. Hydro
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Re: Line level impedance

Post: # 15499Post Hydrolastic »

Hello again, I also adjusted the level on the line amp so when I turned the selector switch to radio or turntable the volume is close to the same. Hydro
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