Buick turn signal switch 101

[electra225]

This little episode reminds me of when I was restoring cars. Packard Torsion Bar ride may be the best example. Learning, in detail, about something I should already know.

I dug in my top-secret box of '63 Buick goodies left over from the restoration and found a correct, correctly coded R63 turn signal switch. It was all grubby and nasty, fresh from the junkyard. There is a series of nine terminals, six of which are arranged in a pyramid fashion, three of which are under the six in pyramid fashion. These three terminals are for the cornering lights. The six in pyramid fashion are arranged in three rows, one on the top, two under it, three under that. The top one is power from the stop light switch, the two under that is for the stop lights, left and right, the three under that are: the outer two are for the left and right turn signals, the middle one is power from the flasher. I tested the switch before I did any cleaning and found its operation to be intermittent, particularly the stop lights. I bought a can of cheap contact cleaner at a parts store and used about half of it getting the switch clean electrically. I gave it a spritz of WD-40 then retested. I have good operation with a good detent at "neutral", neither toward the left or right signals, but in the middle for stop light operation. I don't see why this switch won't work just fine, providing I can get it adjusted properly.

I also had to repair the shop manual for my Buick. It hadn't been used much in the last 25 years or so and is beginning to show its age.....

[William]

And your secret box of goodies is the reason we keep things and do not throw things away.

Bill

[walyfd]

Guessing it's pretty close to this one. One of the crab claws broke on this canceler. Somebody is 3d printing them. Thankfully I had a spare from a 64.

And, I thought I had a major electrical issue when the brake lights didn't work with the ignition off...

The wiring on these early 60s GMs is crazy.

[electra225]

Nope. Not even close. The one you pictured would fit a '65 and newer Buick thru 1968. It would mount under the steering wheel. Mine mounts down further on the column, 15 1/2 inches from the steering wheel. I'll snap a picture of it. The switch that fits my Buick might fit your '62 Cadillac.

[TC Chris]

I'm laughing. The Chevy's cancelers both broke years ago. Fixing involves the new part, of course, but also finding a wheel puller, etc. I've got pretty good at manually canceling so I don't drive along like an old man with the signal going. OK, I am an old man but not one who usually drives with the flasher going.

Chris Campbell

[electra225]

The signals on the Buick cancel just fine. Getting them to WORK is the trick.....

[walyfd]

OH..... I get it... the actual switch is down in the column and the cable actuates the switch regardless of the tilt of the wheel...

Seems kinda dumb. All my 77 and up cads had tilt wheel but the switch is in the hub at the signal lever. How does the cancelation work?

Or perhaps I'm wrong.

[electra225]

You got it. It is a silly system. Riviera used it until 1970. The big Buicks went to the switch you posted in 1965. Comfort steering was a new option in 1963, an attempt to keep up with Chrysler. GM didn't have their ducks in a row when it was introduced. The cancelling mechanism is under the steering wheel where it is commonly found.

[walyfd]

DUMB!!! How in the heck did engineering get this past the bean counters?

What difference should a wheel tilt have on a switch?????

Tilt wheel was a $48.30 option in 1963. Did they break even on it?

[electra225]

On the solid column cars, the turn signal switch was actuated by a lever that went from the cancelling cam to the turn signal switch. They seldom give trouble. Obviously, that solid metal rod will not bend when the column tilts, so they came up with that cable to actuate the switch. It was not a bad idea, they just built it out of plastic, and, 60 years later, the plastic gives up and then there is trouble. The solid cables were obviously the cure, but they are rare as hen's teeth. There are no parts and no repair expertise available anymore.

If I knew then what I know now, I would have put a solid column in when I restored the car. I removed the cruise control because they are dangerous. The actuation cable gets tangled up in the spark plug wires and holds the throttle open......

[walyfd]

I gotta look at the 91 again. I know the headlight dimmer is down by the nss but I think the tss is all at the wheel. Unfortunately the cadillac mpl doesn't show a 63 - 65 tilt column diagram.

I added factory cruise to the 62. It has a rod from the cc brain to the throttle lever at the dashpot that runs under the plug wires. And I use it every chance I get!

[maxidyne]

The Buick cruise control used a chain from the actuator to the carburetor. This chain could get tangled in the spark plug wire retainer and hold the throttle wide open. All you could do was to shut off the ignition then stand on the brakes.

[walyfd]

YIKES!!! Thec82 I had had a chain in some plastic clip that went on the carb. The plastic thing broke and the car decelerated quite quickly. Can't remember how I fixed it.

[electra225]

The '68 Electra I had took off on me on Interstate 70 one afternoon, I had passed a truck and we came to a rise in the road. The cruise control opened up the throttle to maintain speed, when it took off like a shot. Got up to over 100 mph before I decided to shut the ignition off. I left it in Drive, but I got on the brakes as hard as I could. I didn't think the engine was ever going to completely stop. Pre-ignition kept it running, knocking like the dickens, I thought it was a goner. It didn't hurt it, but I removed the cruise control. Every Buick of that vintage that I restored in my shop had the cruise control disabled or removed or I wouldn't work on it.

It was found that the left motor mount was weak enough that when the engine accelerated, the engine rocked over enough to throw the throttle wide open. That cruise control cable got tangled in the plug wires. I put in a new motor mount, then found one of those little straps that they put on Chevy V-8's of that era for much the same reason. The strap kept the engine from rocking over if the motor mount broke or got weak.

[electra225]

Okay, guys, now we can add Buick turn signal switches to the list of crap I get involved with repairing. But, I have to honestly report success! YEA!!! It's only been ten years trying to get those stupid stop lights to work. It was a dirty turn signal switch. Simple as that. I have working stop lights and working turn signals, both sides, front and rear. The cornering lights don't work, so I need to troubleshoot that system. I know the switch is good. Either I don't have power or I have two bad bulbs, both possibilities. I don't have it adjusted 100% correctly, but they work and that's all that matters. I'm not going to mess with progress. It is a LOT tighter under the dash of that Buick than I remember it being, for some reason......

So, to all you Cadillac and Buick guys, the skinny is that the switches for Buick and Cadillac are the same and suffer from the same maladies. The guy who semi-sort-of did the troubleshooting on the Buick said that used or NOS switches would not work, that he had to custom-build switches and wanted $1200 to do that. Horse feathers! And he told me that the cornering light harness was missing. It was plugged into the turn signal switch just like it should have been. Where he got that, I'll never know. I put my spare switch into the car after I "rebuilt" it like we do for switches in electronics. As long as the cable is known good, and the switch is known good, it will work. Adjustment does not appear to be critical. Big Buicks, Riviera, and Cadillacs with the exception of the 75 series take the same switch. I'll bet Olds uses it starting in 1964.

Even a blind hog will find an acorn eventually.......

[walyfd]

Don't forget cornering lights only work with park or headlights on and a turn signal...

[electra225]

I was aware of that. I can troubleshoot from the outside and not have to crawl back under the dash. I'm not nearly as nimble under a dash as I used to be, I can tell you that.

[electra225]

I like trivia, but I also like to get bogged down investigating things that I have already fixed. The shop that worked on the Buick told me that they have to custom-make turn signal switches for 1963-'64 Cadillacs and Buicks with tilt wheel because OEM, whether NOS or used, will not work. This presents two questions that I needed answers to.

First, these are GM production cars. It seems to me that every turn signal switch should work with every car produced that specified that specific switch. And, second, what did that shop do to turn signal switches that turned them into a "custom-built" $1200 turn signal switch. They won't give up their "secret"......

The first thing I learned is that the cable-operated turn signal switch for the early tilt column cars was a typical GM kluge. GM introduced Comfortilt steering before it was fully developed, like many other GM "innovations". "CCC" computer controlled carburetors, front wheel drive, active fuel management, diesel automobile engines, are examples of GM introducing "good ideas" before they had ironed all the bugs out.

Another thing I learned is that the cable I received from the junkyard in Texas is wrong. Wrong size, wrong specs. GM never made an all-metal turn signal cable for the two years of cars we are talking about. Buicks used a 15 1/2 inch long cable. So the information I got to the contrary was bogus. I have no idea what the cable I got actually fits.

Next, the turn signal switch has a two-piece body, connected by a spring. The Riviera guys recommend removing this spring so it doesn't put tension on the cable, hastening its demise. This is a fool's errand. The purpose of that spring is to center the switch so it functions correctly in all modes, regardless of the position of the steering column. Flexing the steering column and pulling against this spring is what breaks the plastic housing on the cable. If you remove the spring, the switch will not stay positioned so either the stop lights or the turn signals will work, or both. Adjustment of the switch with the spring still attached is not uber-critical. As long as the switch is good, not electrically dirty or broken, the lights will work as they should.

My next investigation is to find out the size of cables that work in Chevy cars with tilt wheel. I still find it hard to believe that GM didn't use the same part across their product lines. Something about this still doesn't make sense to me.